Lets talk game plans/strategies

[dtrs5kprs]

37 minutes ago, mjk86 said:

Mind boggling ain't it? 

Not as bad as muskie guys who drop cash on baits just to see fish follow them .

[merc1997 Bo]

5 hours ago, abkeenan said:

Bo, I understand that you make an American Made (and local to us here on OA's) product and you are proud of that and you SHOULD be. It's a dang fine product and I AM one of your customers (as is my brother). Love my/our NuTechs. But at the same time the American worker got lazy, wanted higher pay for less work/efficiency/production which has led to the outsourcing of labor and manufacturing to other counties that will do it for less and are happy to have the work (ie China, Mexico, Vietnam, etc). Is the product as quality as one that is made here in the States? Sometimes yes, often times no. Who is to blame? Ourselves. Unions for one but I am not intending to stir up that hornets nest of a topic. Unions were created out of necessity to protect the worker and over time corrupted by greed to where they have had detrimental impacts on labor force, costs and the overall landscape of our economy not only nationally but on a global level. As so many things do, something that was created for the good and betterment of all has been used and abused to the end resulting in unintended negative consequences that is has been transpiring for decades or if not generations at this point. That is as far as I am going to go into that but one thing for sure is that those jobs aren't coming back anytime soon. As long as you keep making those NuTech's I will be buying....even if you do shift production to China and only charge $1.75 a jig while turning a higher profit margin than you do now! 

you did not hear me say that the american worker does not need some fixing.  dave said it right in his response about labor and the government.  i just wish a whole lot of people would wake up about what is going on in this country.  we need people here working.  no one ever thinks about the fact that if we were in an all out war, the united states can no longer manufacture anything.  wonder if everyone thinks china is going to ship us steel to build stuff with to fight them with.  you can not build even a ball or roller bearing without steel to do it with.  i fish with a retired guy that is also a union guy, and we go at it all the time about unions.  but, there are still some people in this country that try to find ways to still provide jobs for american citizens, and i always try to buy their products when they have something i need.  labor unions at some point need to figure out there has to be balance.  the guy that has everything he owns invested in a company, and works 7 days a week 18 to 20 hours a day to provide others with jobs, deserves to make money on their investment and time.  a worker puts in their 40 hours and then go home and do as they please, while the owner is still slaving away dealing with payroll, materials, taxes, and everything else it takes.  unions do not get this part.

bo

[dtrs5kprs]

That deserves a flag waving woo-hoo! 

[abkeenan]

3 hours ago, merc1997 said:

you did not hear me say that the american worker does not need some fixing.  dave said it right in his response about labor and the government.  i just wish a whole lot of people would wake up about what is going on in this country.  we need people here working.  no one ever thinks about the fact that if we were in an all out war, the united states can no longer manufacture anything.  wonder if everyone thinks china is going to ship us steel to build stuff with to fight them with.  you can not build even a ball or roller bearing without steel to do it with.  i fish with a retired guy that is also a union guy, and we go at it all the time about unions.  but, there are still some people in this country that try to find ways to still provide jobs for american citizens, and i always try to buy their products when they have something i need.  labor unions at some point need to figure out there has to be balance.  the guy that has everything he owns invested in a company, and works 7 days a week 18 to 20 hours a day to provide others with jobs, deserves to make money on their investment and time.  a worker puts in their 40 hours and then go home and do as they please, while the owner is still slaving away dealing with payroll, materials, taxes, and everything else it takes.  unions do not get this part.

bo

You want an honest answer to that? How to get work, jobs and manufacturing back to the U S of A? Get rid of unions. In a capitalist system the market will take care of itself and auto correct. Companies that get it right will prosper, companies that don't will fail and cease to exist. That is free market CAPITALISM. Get with the program or you're toast. That will never happen because at this point there is too much money on the line for union fat cats, lobbyest and special interest groups all in bed with the government. It's a pipe dream that I'll never see. It's not all that simple but it would be a lovely start. In my opinion unions have outlived their useful existence. With the current state of mind of the average American no company would be paying employees working for pennies on the dollar, exhausting hours or in unsafe working conditions. This isn't the early 20th century anymore Toto. Now I will say that anyone on here that is in a union I am NOT taking a shot at you. My grandfather, his brothers, my cousin, FIL and plenty of other close friends and family members were all or are currently union members.  All of which I have the utmost respect for and all that they did/do.They did what was/is best for their own interest and for their families. I am simply stating that unions as a system or function stink.

[Sore Thumbs]

As long as China is still making everything for us. There is no way they would go to war against the United States. It would be economic suicide. 

[dtrs5kprs]

3 hours ago, Sore Thumbs said:

As long as China is still making everything for us. There is no way they would go to war against the United States. It would be economic suicide. 

Interesting point.

[nhornback]

Quite a 180 in talking points relative to talking about the ned rig...

How about prespawn transition talk? 

My 2016 game plan to try and further my understanding of how fish move relative to the seasons is to pick a small area of the lake from main lake to creek arms and fish that small area as often as I can, which for me is probably once or twice a month.  My thought is that if I can find them out deep in the next few weeks I can use those main lake/ deep spots as starting points to find them as they move toward spawning areas.

I've read differing things on transition, maybe they're both true. I've heard that some bass won't travel in more than a couple hundred yard radius their whole lives, and also heard just the opposite.  Anyone have any thoughts on that? 

Thanks as always

[dtrs5kprs]

51 minutes ago, nhornback said:

Quite a 180 in talking points relative to talking about the ned rig...

How about prespawn transition talk? 

My 2016 game plan to try and further my understanding of how fish move relative to the seasons is to pick a small area of the lake from main lake to creek arms and fish that small area as often as I can, which for me is probably once or twice a month.  My thought is that if I can find them out deep in the next few weeks I can use those main lake/ deep spots as starting points to find them as they move toward spawning areas.

I've read differing things on transition, maybe they're both true. I've heard that some bass won't travel in more than a couple hundred yard radius their whole lives, and also heard just the opposite.  Anyone have any thoughts on that? 

Thanks as always

This can be an odd lake. They will spawn in all kinds of places, from March (if it is warm) all the way into June. With one day a month to fish it will be hard to stay with them, in terms of movement. April is probably easiest, not because you can stay with them, but because you are apt to find some going one way or the other.

Brown fish like to spawn on gravel, or small mixed rock. Blacks and spots seem to like bigger rock. Blacks like dock corners, wood, etc., cover oriented. Spots will spawn all over ledge rock and bluff rock. All of them like a big flat rock, or seem to. Look for places that help them move from deep water to those kinds of rock- a succession of points, swing banks, etc. Check "rest stops", especially if the weather is nasty. Transition rock, points, brush on flats, etc. Always easier to check shallow fish first, just don't force them.

Seems to me there are " resident" fish in a lot of the big creeks. Same idea as resident geese and ducks. Some creeks have more, some less. Those fish are always somewhat available. More will move in with spring. Those are the fish that can be quick to leave. Same for fish that get in the coves/pockets/dips in the river. Very transient. If you hit one of those moves in the small places it can be a blast on Friday, then Zero on Saturday. Creek fish strike me as being more stable. Once they move in, they tend to stay. May not stay in the same place or do the same things, but less likely to disappear entirely.

[Old plug]

10 hours ago, abkeenan said:You want an honest answer to that? How to get work, jobs and manufacturing back to the U S of A? Get rid of unions. In a capitalist system the market will take care of itself and auto correct. Companies that get it right will prosper, companies that don't will fail and cease to exist. That is free market CAPITALISM. Get with the program or you're toast. That will never happen because at this point there is too much money on the line for union fat cats, lobbyest and special interest groups all in bed with the government. It's a pipe dream that I'll never see. It's not all that simple but it would be a lovely start. In my opinion unions have outlived their useful existence. With the current state of mind of the average American no company would be paying employees working for pennies on the dollar, exhausting hours or in unsafe working conditions. This isn't the early 20th century anymore Toto. Now I will say that anyone on here that is in a union I am NOT taking a shot at you. My grandfather, his brothers, my cousin, FIL and plenty of other close friends and family members were all or are currently union members.  All of which I have the utmost respect for and all that they did/do.They did what was/is best for their own interest and for their families. I am simply stating that unions as a system or function stink.

You got a good point there. And I agree with champ as well. i have fought my share of battles with the union.  I have been on both side of that coin. Unions today are not good by any means. but on the other hand I do not trust bussiness either. Your to young to know what happens if bussiness is allowed total control. My father when down into the coal mines at the age of 7. So did his brothers. You know what ? He never made a dime. They lived far out with no store are shopping. So the coal  company opened there own store at highly inflated prices. My fathers earnings went to help pay off the company store. Many weeks nobody in the family got money.they just got a reciept for how much they still owed the store. 

This was during the days of John L Lewis rying to organize the miners. The coal companies were like the steel companies they had such lo opion of the workers they kind of figured them as expendable. They along with the steel people gunned down for more minors than will ever be known. Working in a  coal mine was outrught slavery. 

My mother was a seamstress. Got paid pennies doing peice work. Worked in a large room. Where they were locked in. The windows  were kept closed because they did not want insects getting into the cloth.  There were no cieling fans.  In the summer it was so hot  some women would get sick and pass out. The answer to that was to fire them because they were not tough enough. Mom told me trying to go to the bathroom was like begging. 

These kind of things are what is going on in China and other areas. It is very clear to me bussiness supports this kind of thing. I certainly do not want to see return of that in this country. The entire labor managment thing is a very complex issue that is only part of the over all problems with this country that is coming apart at the seams. The key is attitude.  Its not going to change. But there sure is change coming. When it doe it ill make the civil war look like a skirmish. 

[abkeenan]

14 minutes ago, nhornback said:

Quite a 180 in talking points relative to talking about the ned rig...

How about prespawn transition talk? 

My 2016 game plan to try and further my understanding of how fish move relative to the seasons is to pick a small area of the lake from main lake to creek arms and fish that small area as often as I can, which for me is probably once or twice a month.  My thought is that if I can find them out deep in the next few weeks I can use those main lake/ deep spots as starting points to find them as they move toward spawning areas.

I've read differing things on transition, maybe they're both true. I've heard that some bass won't travel in more than a couple hundred yard radius their whole lives, and also heard just the opposite.  Anyone have any thoughts on that? 

Thanks as always

Sorry about that. I derailed this thread twice with union talk and swimbait chatter. But it's the winter and that's what we do during this lull in the fishing season. Go at each other since we can't get after the fish (most if us anyways).