Bigmouth Buffalo 100+ years old

[snagged in outlet 3]

50 minutes ago, Quillback said:

If you have any bow fishing buddies, send them to the James River arm above Flat Creek.  The gar are unbelievably thick up there.  I don't know if a lot of gar have an effect on the bass, but the bass fishing hasn't been too good up there the last couple of years.  

I don’t think I’ve ever had good fishing if there were a lot of gar around.   I always think if they are there it’s probably poor water quality. 🤷‍♂️.   Just a guess.  

[Quillback]

6 minutes ago, snagged in outlet 3 said:

I don’t think I’ve ever had good fishing if there were a lot of gar around.   I always think if they are there it’s probably poor water quality. 🤷‍♂️.   Just a guess.  

There are tons of shad up there, lots of food for those gar.  A lot of spoonbill too.  I asked Dutch if he has ever seen that many gar on the James and he says he never has.

[fishinwrench]

Odd thing about gar, there are certain spots on the lake where they are always thick, year round, and for no particular reason that I am aware of.   There has to be a reason why they congregate in those little areas.....but whatever that reason is remains a head-scratcher.  🤔 

They've been there reliably for 30+ years at least.   

And yeah, I can verify that sinking brush around a "Gar hole" is a waste of time. 🙄  It would suck to buy a piece of lakefront property, then discover that it is a Gar hole !  

[Johnsfolly]

I don't recall if this was the same study that we discussed a few years ago. I have the same concerns now as I did them. It's  cool that they can live so long. However if there is limited or no recruitment of juveniles in the population it is destined to collapse over time. Makes me wonder what is going on and why there are no juveniles surviving. Are the embryos not hatching, not enough or the right food for fry survival and growth, bad water conditions...

[Quillback]

13 hours ago, Johnsfolly said:

I don't recall if this was the same study that we discussed a few years ago. I have the same concerns now as I did them. It's  cool that they can live so long. However if there is limited or no recruitment of juveniles in the population it is destined to collapse over time. Makes me wonder what is going on and why there are no juveniles surviving. Are the embryos not hatching, not enough or the right food for fry survival and growth, bad water conditions...

There's some speculation on recruitment in this article.  An interesting point they make is that one of the reasons that nature has made these fish long-lived is that they need certain conditions to spawn and have fry survival.  Living a long time gives them a lot of chances to try.  

Bigmouth buffalo - Wikipedia

[BilletHead]

47 minutes ago, Quillback said:

There's some speculation on recruitment in this article.  An interesting point they make is that one of the reasons that nature has made these fish long-lived is that they need certain conditions to spawn and have fry survival.  Living a long time gives them a lot of chances to try.  

Bigmouth buffalo - Wikipedia

                 I have watched buffalo spawn on the Schell Osage wildlife area. It was pretty neat. Lots of them in the remaining lake there. Plans are the drained lake is still going to be rebuilt and restocked. Larger with a bigger dam that might, and I say might keep the Osage from flooding allowing the common carp to trash it up. Like most of you here it's fine with me to control the take of the native buffalo. As @Ham said he thought I was condoning bowfishing. I do to a point. I bow fished a lot many moons ago. I did shoot buffalo, but I ate them, did not massacre them. Canned and fried those fish and did the same with some carp. When the river came up and out of its banks it literally spewed common carp into the flooded fields this brought us out to shoot them and also locals that did not gig or bow fish. they came with coolers and tubs asking for some fish. I am telling you some needed these fish. We always shared and they were grateful. Here is another thing to think about. When pictures of bad habits are posted everyone remembers this and it sticks in our memories. Not everyone does this. While common carp are here to stay and are (naturalized) it doesn't mean it's OK. We will never stay ahead of this mistake. Kill at your will but haul them off for fertilizer and proper disposal or eat them. I don't know what MDC thinks about overharvest of native buffalo, but I can tell you at Schell Osage Wildlife area they don't care. Each year floods spew out these fish and carp and gar and game fish into the "duck pools" and each year these pools during the summer dry up. All the fish begin to suffocate and dye until nothing is left but wriggling gar and they die. You have a wasteland of fish bones. Many years ago, there was a salvage deal, and it was advertised. Seining was allowed. MDC watched and took all the remaining gamefish to the lake. Carp and buffalo were fair game, and they went to good use. That doesn't happen anymore. 

[Quillback]

Hey Marty @BilletHead, What species of buffalo are those you're seeing up there?  Seems like they are concerned about the bigmouth buffalo up north. down here maybe they are plentiful.  Or maybe they are smallmouth buffalo, I think there are black buffalo also.  

[BilletHead]

4 minutes ago, Quillback said:

Hey Marty @BilletHead, What species of buffalo are those you're seeing up there?  Seems like they are concerned about the bigmouth buffalo up north. down here maybe they are plentiful.  Or maybe they are smallmouth buffalo, I think there are black buffalo also.  

             All of the species and I mean all of them. when the river came out, they would go out with it and when the river went back into its banks some of the fish would return. Some would stay in the back waters.  On the levy roads there were deeper spots as water crossed the roads. I would stand in awe watching the fish pass. Smaller fish all you could see were back fins, bigger fish backs and the largest fish would actually pass over on their sides. I think you could have walked across those fish.  If I was bow fishing that day my target was grass carp because they were the best eating. 

[Quillback]

3 minutes ago, BilletHead said:

             All of the species and I mean all of them. when the river came out, they would go out with it and when the river went back into its banks some of the fish would return. Some would stay in the back waters.  On the levy roads there were deeper spots as water crossed the roads. I would stand in awe watching the fish pass. Smaller fish all you could see were back fins, bigger fish backs and the largest fish would actually pass over on their sides. I think you could have walked across those fish.  If I was bow fishing that day my target was grass carp because they were the best eating. 

Didn't know grass carp were any good to eat.  We have a lake in Bella Vista that was getting quite a bit of hydrilla growth.  The bass fishing for a while was outstanding, and it was great during August and September when bass fishing is usually tough.  I was getting 20-40 bass everytime out, and they were nice chunky fish, up to 4 lbs. that were chasing shad.  It was a blast.

So the lakes "manager" decided to stock some grass carp fingerlings several years ago.  They completely wiped out the hydrilla and now the bass fishing stinks.  There are now some monster grass carp in that lake.  I hooked one this summer on a swimbait, don't know if I snagged it, but it appeared to have it in its mouth.  I jacked around for close to an hour trying to boat that sucker, but it never even got close to getting tired.  Finally the hook came out.  I got a few glimpses of it, looked to be 4 feet long.  It was massive.

So just recently the lakes manager has proposed a $100 bounty on the grass carp.  It might go into effect in March. If you want to come down here and pop them I'll be glad to shuttle you around.  😀

 

[BilletHead]

6 minutes ago, Quillback said:

Didn't know grass carp were any good to eat.  We have a lake in Bella Vista that was getting quite a bit of hydrilla growth.  The bass fishing for a while was outstanding, and it was great during August and September when bass fishing is usually tough.  I was getting 20-40 bass everytime out, and they were nice chunky fish, up to 4 lbs. that were chasing shad.  It was a blast.

So the lakes "manager" decided to stock some grass carp fingerlings several years ago.  They completely wiped out the hydrilla and now the bass fishing stinks.  There are now some monster grass carp in that lake.  I hooked one this summer on a swimbait, don't know if I snagged it, but it appeared to have it in its mouth.  I jacked around for close to an hour trying to boat that sucker, but it never even got close to getting tired.  Finally the hook came out.  I got a few glimpses of it, looked to be 4 feet long.  It was massive.

So just recently the lakes manager has proposed a $100 bounty on the grass carp.  It might go into effect in March. If you want to come down here and pop them I'll be glad to shuttle you around.  😀

 

              Jeff their meat is snow white. You still have to deal with a few extra bones but no different than frying a bluegill whole. Bigger bones in bigger fish also. Worth it IMO. I would do the trip if I could shoot a conventional bow still. The bad shoulder took that away. If that bounty is a real deal those fish will not last long!