North Fork issue

[Flyfisher for men]

15 hours ago, tjm said:

It is the oldest Federal Hatchery still in operation, not the first. Baird Hatchery on California’s McCloud River, was the first Federal fresh water hatchery in 1872.

Thanks for the correction. I'm swamped with class prep right now, but will look at that other material later. Looks interesting.

[gotmuddy]

43 minutes ago, Mitch f said:

This is wrong...I know of people who had had their entire ponds wiped out of catfish in no time back when they were first introduced.

comparing a pond with catfish to a stream with trout is apples to oranges.

[Mitch f]

9 minutes ago, gotmuddy said:

comparing a pond with catfish to a stream with trout is apples to oranges.

Same thing happens to a streams, Until the trappers got things a little better

[Flyfisher for men]

17 hours ago, fishinwrench said:

Why in the world would they have chosen Missouri for the first federal hatchery, I wonder?  

I wonder what the Missouri and Mississippi rivers were like before all of the mass agriculture.  

TJM corrected me on this--he says it's the oldest still in existence. Aside from what I said earlier about water supply and railroads, I can't really say any more.

 

[Mitch f]

I want to get @Al Agnew into this conversation if possible. 
Hey Al, what is your thought on the introduction of otters in Missouri, and do you feel the situation is in a manageable state right now? 

[Johnsfolly]

26 minutes ago, Mitch f said:

Same thing happens to a streams, Until the trappers got things a little better

When I first moved to Columbia I fished Hickson creek pretty regularly. Would catch LMB, spotted bass, smallmouth, bluegill etc. All of these were caught within the city limits. I decided to go further upstream one spring. I was hitting similar holes and catching a few fish. Then I got to a great long hole in terms of cover and water depth. I just knew that I would catch a bunch. Nothing, Nada, Zilch. I only saw one or two tiny bluegill. 

As I fished towards the upstream end two very healthy otters were swimming around. I can't  help but think that they cleaned out the fish that I had suspected would be in this spot. I left soon after seeing them. Figured wouldn't catch much and I didn't  trust not being able to see them while I was wading the creek.

[Mitch f]

2 minutes ago, Johnsfolly said:

When I first moved to Columbia I fished Hickson creek pretty regularly. Would catch LMB, spotted bass, smallmouth, bluegill etc. All of these were caught within the city limits. I decided to go further upstream one spring. I was hitting similar holes and catching a few fish. Then I got to a great long hole in terms of cover and water depth. I just knew that I would catch a bunch. Nothing, Nada, Zilch. I only saw one or two tiny bluegill. 

As I fished towards the upstream end two very healthy otters were swimming around. I can't  help but think that they cleaned out the fish that I had suspected would be in this spot. I left soon after seeing them. Figured wouldn't catch much and I didn't  trust not being able to see them while I was wading the creek.

In a small way it reminds me of the introduction of wolves in Yellowstone. Everyone has a different view of the success, I know some ranchers that aren’t happy. 

[Ham]

3 hours ago, Mitch f said:

This is wrong...I know of people who had had their entire ponds wiped out of catfish in no time back when they were first introduced.

And people used to shoot every road runner they saw because they were convinced road runners were why the quail numbers were down.

people have no right to kill animals they don’t like just because. If you kill animals out of season, with illegal means, or wantonly waste them that defines you as a poacher. 

[Mitch f]

1 minute ago, Ham said:

And people used to shoot every road runner they saw because they were convinced road runners were why the quail numbers were down.

people have no right to kill animals they don’t like just because. If you kill animals out of season, with illegal means, or wantonly waste them that defines you as a poacher. 

Ok, I’m a poacher

[Gavin]

We had a serious HATE going on with the introduced Otters 20-30 years ago....They Screwed up ALLOT of good fishing! Their population appears to have leveled out, established some form of equilibrium, or we just got used to suckier fishing. I don't see as many Otter slides or Otters...So hope they died out. Nasty creatures. CO's had no issue with killing Otters at that time....It was what it was.