Let's take a moment.

[fishinwrench]

1 minute ago, Mitch f said:

So maybe you could call the wives of the pentagon bound plane passengers  and talk with them

As I said, I've washed my hands of the entire fairytale.    

If you start from the beginning, and stop as soon as the first assumption needs to be made.......You won't have even gotten anyone on a single plane yet.   

[Daryk Campbell Sr]

It is tough to realize it has been 20 years.  I do love a good conspiracy,  and always dislike the way I am treated or pushed aside for asking questions that don't seem to fit an agenda.  Why cant we have a true conversation.   I will listen to anyone's view, but most won't listen to mine.  Dont get me wrong, I'm not a tin hat guy.  But there are many unanswered questions, I like to discuss why. 

[fishinwrench]

2 hours ago, Daryk Campbell Sr said:

It is tough to realize it has been 20 years.  I do love a good conspiracy,  and always dislike the way I am treated or pushed aside for asking questions that don't seem to fit an agenda.  Why cant we have a true conversation.   I will listen to anyone's view, but most won't listen to mine.  Dont get me wrong, I'm not a tin hat guy.  But there are many unanswered questions, I like to discuss why. 

The ones that have the answers......aren't accepting any questions.  They are pleading the 5th.   So there's really nothing to discuss other than debating the possibilities......which are basically endless.   

The only thing we'll ever know for sure, is that 3 buildings were destroyed, and the Pentagon was damaged, and some innocent folks within the buildings along with some rescue workers were either badly injured or killed, and that the president and all of the "important people" just happened to be in a safe and sheltered place at the time.  Oh, and that all the records from an investigation on a mysteriously missing 14 trillion dollars are now gone.  Can't continue the investigation without those records.  Darn!!!

Everything else about the situation is subjective, and the powers that be intend to keep it that way.     

Every year when folks say....."Never Forget 9-11"......Well, it doesn't matter if you forget or not, because you don't KNOW what not to forget in the first place.      🙄

[Al Agnew]

13 hours ago, Mitch f said:

 

I pretty much agree with everything you’ve said but would like to put a large asterisk by this last sentence of yours…

I’m blaming the division on the commies in our education system and media that are former hippies taught by the Karl Marx philosophy. They love to force people in different socioeconomic, ethnic and gender groups which creates a bunch of divided groups waring for power. You’re not an individual anymore, but part of some identity group. 
The leaders in the US (and world for that matter) of today remind me of the rich , woke hippie son that took over dads successful business he started from scratch and turned it into an unsuccessful mess.

Mitch, spend some time on Facebook...if you have the number and variety of "friends" I have on there, you will be exposed to hundreds of memes per day where one side is attacking the other side and mostly misrepresenting what the other side is all about.  It's done by so-called conservatives and so-called liberals, by so-called Democrats and so-called Republicans.  I say "so-called" because it's been proven that many of these vile memes originate in Russia and other countries, but then get passed along by ordinary Americans who take them in hook, line, and sinker.  Somebody said recently in a discussion like this that we are being divided by the political elites (and they meant on both sides).  I responded that, nope, we are being divided by cynical people motivated by greed or ideology who continually post crap on social media, and we are also being divided by cynical media personalities who know that outrage sells, and the more they can rouse the rabble the greater their market share is.  And we are completely complicit in this, because many, perhaps most, of us NEVER make the attempt to actually hear what the other side is saying, we let the personalities on our side TELL us what the other side is saying.  And those personalities have a vested interest in demonizing the other side.  

You are looking at it from your side.  You think the dividing is all being done by those commie liberals.  Bullcrap.  The dividing is being done by both sides in just the ways I've described above, by making the other side look as horrible as possible and by people never actually listening to the viewpoint of the other side.  

One of the truths I've learned in nearly 70 years on earth is that we all have an infinite ability to convince ourselves that what we want to be true is true, and to grasp any evidence that reinforces our viewpoint and ignore or denigrate any evidence that doesn't.  With all the knowledge in the world at our fingertips, we are becoming more and more tribal, using the internet not to get facts or wide ranges of opinions, but only going to the places on the net that tell us what we want to hear.  

[tjm]

We lost our freedom and the constitution on that day, but gwb came out of it a hero with the best rehearsed speech he ever made, maybe the only articulate speech he ever made. So there is always a silver lining for someone.

[snagged in outlet 3]

On a good note.  The lady across the street put a note on the Nextdoor app Friday night collecting items for refugees.  By noon yesterday her driveway was overflowing with donated items.  No kidding.  Everything from clothes and kitchen items to bikes and toys for kids.   @fishinwrench, that is my 🇺🇸 

[Mitch f]

11 hours ago, Al Agnew said:

Mitch, spend some time on Facebook...if you have the number and variety of "friends" I have on there, you will be exposed to hundreds of memes per day where one side is attacking the other side and mostly misrepresenting what the other side is all about.  It's done by so-called conservatives and so-called liberals, by so-called Democrats and so-called Republicans.  I say "so-called" because it's been proven that many of these vile memes originate in Russia and other countries, but then get passed along by ordinary Americans who take them in hook, line, and sinker.  Somebody said recently in a discussion like this that we are being divided by the political elites (and they meant on both sides).  I responded that, nope, we are being divided by cynical people motivated by greed or ideology who continually post crap on social media, and we are also being divided by cynical media personalities who know that outrage sells, and the more they can rouse the rabble the greater their market share is.  And we are completely complicit in this, because many, perhaps most, of us NEVER make the attempt to actually hear what the other side is saying, we let the personalities on our side TELL us what the other side is saying.  And those personalities have a vested interest in demonizing the other side.  

You are looking at it from your side.  You think the dividing is all being done by those commie liberals.  Bullcrap.  The dividing is being done by both sides in just the ways I've described above, by making the other side look as horrible as possible and by people never actually listening to the viewpoint of the other side.  

One of the truths I've learned in nearly 70 years on earth is that we all have an infinite ability to convince ourselves that what we want to be true is true, and to grasp any evidence that reinforces our viewpoint and ignore or denigrate any evidence that doesn't.  With all the knowledge in the world at our fingertips, we are becoming more and more tribal, using the internet not to get facts or wide ranges of opinions, but only going to the places on the net that tell us what we want to hear.  

We will just have to agree to disagree

[jdmidwest]

Vacation over, nice thing about Riverton, no teck.

They are coming back.  Soon probably.  We have let our guard down and lost our backbone.

Remember the colored conditions of our countries state of probability?

[snagged in outlet 3]

44 minutes ago, jdmidwest said:

d lost our backbone.

Old saying. 
Hard times make hard men.   Hard men make soft times.  Soft times make soft men.  Soft men make hard times.  

[fishinwrench]

2 hours ago, snagged in outlet 3 said:

Old saying. 
Hard times make hard men.   Hard men make soft times.  Soft times make soft men.  Soft men make hard times.  

Is that the circle of life ?